Integrate Bitcoin Payments into the site

[Masons Monarch]

Hello everyone, this is something I have been thinking about for a while, at this time, I feel very strongly that this indeed should be implemented given the benefits it could bring. Yes, it may very well take a while to develop however, the pros outway the cons.

Resources. Allow me to begin by listing some problems we have with resources:

• Resource authors do not have a verified (or otherwise reliable) paypal account or opportunity to create one thus barring them from selling.
• Resource authors frequently deal with fraudulent chargebacks (Check out some examples here and here)
• Many resource buyers cannot use paypal to purchase resources(Due to their age, verification status, location, etc)
• Many people prefer using cryptocurrency due to low verification requirements, the simplicity of of its use, and issues that otherwise are problems with paypal one (such as limitations, account freezes, holds, payment reviews, etc)

Here's my take on what benefits using bitcoin in the resource system could bring:

• Resource authors should be able to have their resources sold in bitcoin. This should have a hidden requirement in the event that a chargeback is needed to recover funds.
  • Allowing payments via bitcoin will attract customers who otherwise would not pay with paypal.
  • Prevent fraudulent chargebacks
  • Prevent holds from delaying or stopping the resource from being delivered (this is a huge problem and current on MCMs development list)
  • Prevent fees induced by Paypal Goods & Services transactions (or atleast reduce fees)
• There are quite a few users who are under the age of 18 and do not have the ability to verify their paypal. This frequently bars them from be able to easily sending and receiving payments aswell as in this case, checking out like everyone else.
• Cryptocurrency is preferred by alot of people due to the seller safety, ease of use, and low fees. All of which would benefit sellers.

Paypal is overall a difficult program to work with on this forum. Why? Paypals ideal seller is shipping physical merchandise (on markets such as ebay) and providing tracking information for each transaction. This way, they can easily settle disputes, track a sellers activity and ensure its legitimacy, all resulting in less money loss. Selling digital items on paypal is something they will let you do, however, sometimes only for a while, resulting in limitations (usually permanent) constant holds and security reviews, all inconveniences to both resource authors and buyers. Here are some links I found to prove my point:

• https://www.mc-market.org/threads/548285/
  
• https://www.mc-market.org/threads/458440/

Integrating bitcoin in other parts of the site, such as advertising and upgrades, is smart aswell. Here are some benefits I've listed out:

• Sometimes payments do not go through with paypal leading to scam reports being made on Mick. Even worse, the buyer is forced to chargeback which they almost always get warning points for. (For reference, check scam reports on Mick 's profile). Problems like these are unlikely with bitcoin, no chargebacks can be issued and thus no warning points.
• Again, many people prefer bitcoin, do to its ease. I think it would highly motivate people to buy more advertisements, and even upgrades.

Please leave your thoughts on this, I'm certainly wanting to hear people build on my idea, as I think implementing this into the site in the best way possible is ideal and necessary. Thank you for reading

 

[Landon]

I suggested Bitcoin as a method for upgrades back when I first joined, and it was declined. Views can change, but throwing it out there that Mick has declined it in the past. Plus, Bitcoin is volatile so a $4.99 payment received could be $2 next month, which in turn provides a loss in potential profit.

As for resources, it'd be insanely hard to implement as you'd need an some Bitcoin payment processor (such as BitPay) and an individual API key for every user.

 

[Venture]

It doesn't matter about the volatility of bitcoin, it's up for the seller to accept it or not. People who hate Paypal, like me, and prefer to only use BTC will start actually giving a crap about the resource section and looking at it.

 

[Landon]

It doesn't matter about the volatility of bitcoin, it's up for the seller to accept it or not. People who hate Paypal, like me, and prefer to only use BTC will start actually giving a crap about the resource section and looking at it.

I’m talking about implementation for upgrades, advertisements, etc. Volatility does matter then.

 

[MTG]

Except you looked into the POV of chargebacking in the seller view's only, if someone gets scammed and the seller only accepted btc, then RIP all the buyers.

 

[Eccat]

I would love to see this added. I don't currently have PayPal but have stuff I would love to upload to the resource section but can't. I'm not sure how good it would be for upgrades but for resources 10/10 idea. You could use a processor like Mycelium as it has little to no fees.

 

[Masons Monarch]

PayPal's worked fine for me for all of my transactions on every site.
However, there's nothing but advantages using bitcoin for resources (no chargebacks, no SRs since resources are approved for quality)
I can see disadvantages when dealing with bitcoin in terms of upgrades though, Mick may not wish to keep any of the sites revenue in such an unstable, hype-based currency.
Overall, I agree to the usage in resources.

Indeed. And yes, I do understand that on Micks part. As bitcoin is an incredibly volatile currency, of which many people despise this, do not care much for it. I would imagine it is indeed relatively hard to store funds from a business none-the-less in holdings such as that.

We could be converting it or find a crypto wallet that is more suited for this type of thing. However, I do agree that it would be a concern on his part, as I suspect once bitcoin is fully integrated, more people would use bitcoin than paypal.

It doesn't matter about the volatility of bitcoin, it's up for the seller to accept it or not. People who hate Paypal, like me, and prefer to only use BTC will start actually giving a crap about the resource section and looking at it.

Very true. The most important part of this thread in my opinion is integrating it into resources, which would have little to no effect on Mick.

The above statement when I was responding to Aquarium ‘s post would only be an issue if he integrates crypto for buying advertisements and upgrades.

PayPal was good in the old days. We all know that. You could create an account with fake info in seconds and start to receive and send payments without any verification, only e-mail at most.

Sadly, those times are over. Today if you want to even use PayPal in any way or shape you MUST verify your identity. Its ridiculous. And not only that, you have to deal with charge-backs, holds, account freezes and all the shit we all have been through. PayPal is not good anymore and everyone knows that.

If this suggestion ever happens they should expand it to upgrades too. For example, I WANT to buy Supreme. I have the money, I want to spend it. But I fucking can't because I can't access to PayPal, so a potential customer was lost just because of that.
And, seriously, we are in 2020, implementing a Bitcoin payment processor is the easiest thing to do. You don't even have to worry about volatility, if you want you can have all your invoices converted to USD in less than second.

Interesting that you bring this up, I could discuss this topic eagerly for quite a bit however I will keep it short and simple. Verification is incredibly important. The reason for doing it ranges from effectively tracking income for government agencies (the IRS for example) all the way to avoiding blackhat activities (like terrorism).

Yes, it is obnoxious. Many parts of paypal are obnoxious and are frequently nothing short of an annoyance (like their internal security system which constantly blocks and declines payments, limits accounts, and initiates security reviews with little justification.

Anyway, yes. Paypal causes a variety of issues with users on this site who are unable to provide information to paypal that allows them to successfully use the site, bitcoin would help.

SSH, I know you have been in this situation where you cannot use paypal effectively and as such switched to bitcoin. Your input would be much appreciated.

Ethereum would also be good

Though ethereum is a widely used, and preferred by some people, I consider bitcoin to be a better idea (if we could only choose one) due to bitcoin being transaction in far greater magnitude on this site. (I am a crypto dealer and rarely ever get people buyer ethereum)

Except you looked into the POV of chargebacking in the seller view's only, if someone gets scammed and the seller only accepted btc, then RIP all the buyers.

A valid point. However in the post I said the following:

Resource authors should be able to have their resources sold in bitcoin. This should have a hidden requirement in the event that a chargeback is needed to recover funds.

Because this could easily be exploited, the right to sell resources via crypto should be a privilege reserved for well-know members and those with resource selling experienced.

I would love to see this added. I don't currently have PayPal but have stuff I would love to upload to the resource section but can't. I'm not sure how good it would be for upgrades but for resources 10/10 idea. You could use a processor like Mycelium as it has little to no fees.

The main idea of this post is to benefit resources, and moreover, resource sellers like yourself. The idea of integrating into ads and upgrades is a more abstract idea thrown out there. Thank you for your input.

 

[Venture]

I’m talking about implementation for upgrades, advertisements, etc. Volatility does matter then.

If they use something like coinbase they can convert the currency daily or upon getting it into a more stable coin. In addition, what's better?

1) Someone buying a $30 rank with a small chance that it can down $3, but likewise, go up $3
2) Or, no one buying at all

Some money is better than no money

 

[SSH]

Indeed. And yes, I do understand that on Micks part. As bitcoin is an incredibly volatile currency, of which many people despise this, do not care much for it. I would imagine it is indeed relatively hard to store funds from a business none-the-less in holdings such as that.

We could be converting it or find a crypto wallet that is more suited for this type of thing. However, I do agree that it would be a concern on his part, as I suspect once bitcoin is fully integrated, more people would use bitcoin than paypal.


Very true. The most important part of this thread in my opinion is integrating it into resources, which would have little to no effect on Mick.

The above statement when I was responding to Aquarium ‘s post would only be an issue if he integrates crypto for buying advertisements and upgrades.


Interesting that you bring this up, I could discuss this topic eagerly for quite a bit however I will keep it short and simple. Verification is incredibly important. The reason for doing it ranges from effectively tracking income for government agencies (the IRS for example) all the way to avoiding blackhat activities (like terrorism).

Yes, it is obnoxious. Many parts of paypal are obnoxious and are frequently nothing short of an annoyance (like their internal security system which constantly blocks and declines payments, limits accounts, and initiates security reviews with little justification.

Anyway, yes. Paypal causes a variety of issues with users on this site who are unable to provide information to paypal that allows them to successfully use the site, bitcoin would help.

SSH, I know you have been in this situation where you cannot use paypal effectively and as such switched to bitcoin. Your input would be much appreciated.


Though ethereum is a widely used, and preferred by some people, I consider bitcoin to be a better idea (if we could only choose one) due to bitcoin being transaction in far greater magnitude on this site. (I am a crypto dealer and rarely ever get people buyer ethereum)


A valid point. However in the post I said the following:



Because this could easily be exploited, the right to sell resources via crypto should be a privilege reserved for well-know members and those with resource selling experienced.


The main idea of this post is to benefit resources, and moreover, resource sellers like yourself. The idea of integrating into ads and upgrades is a more abstract idea thrown out there. Thank you for your input.

Long ass comment but thanks for the ping. Yeah, I agree with this and wanted to buy ultimate before but couldn't as my debit card was frozen. I just couldn't. I believe that it may be harder to file taxes and track sales but I think for the business side of MCM, it could bring in tons more money and make it worth the extra bookkeeping work.

 

[Masons Monarch]

Long ass comment but thanks for the ping. Yeah, I agree with this and wanted to buy ultimate before but couldn't as my debit card was frozen. I just couldn't. I believe that it may be harder to file taxes and track sales but I think for the business side of MCM, it could bring in tons more money and make it worth the extra bookkeeping work.

That is another thing. MCM is a legally registered subsidiary while many other forums who use bitcoin are not. I do not know exactly if bitcoin specifically would have an effect, however, I would imagine any extra account where you are receiving money for said business would be a burden filing business taxes.

If they use something like coinbase they can convert the currency daily or upon getting it into a more stable coin. In addition, what's better?

1) Someone buying a $30 rank with a small chance that it can down $3, but likewise, go up $3
2) Or, no one buying at all

Some money is better than no money

An excellent point, thank you for stating this.

Volatility can be an issue and should be considered however, the owner of this site is of a legal age to create an account with the ability to swap the payments into a more stable crypto or just simply transfer it to USD on a daily basis.

 

[Niteburn]

I have used PayPal for a long time and I have not dealt with getting an account locked nor losing a chargeback. Implementing this for the website it could complicate things for the back-end of things (e.g. reporting taxes) and accepting multiple payment methods.

Also is it possible to setup a subscription (e.g. Ultimate Rank) with Coinbase or something?

 

[Mick]

We're looking into possibly allowing for people to sell their resources with bitcoin in the future. Very recently I've done a bit of a 180 and now am considering adding in other payment methods like bitcoin and stripe for account upgrades, but that'll depend on a number of factors and I'd definitely need to look into it some more.

Unless something drastic happens, I doubt we'd get around to doing something like this any time soon though, and I believe I have something else pending (or soon to be) for this. So denied, thanks for the suggestion