Well that's why this whole situation is simply fucked up. It's plain obvious that Mick and his daddy used BeBosny to keep their little investment here afloat. I mean this is just some corrupt scheme and Mc-Market is the center of all of it.
MC-market changes - Discuss
- Thread starter Ivain
- Start date
- Status
Everyone is throwing their own numbers around for what the site was earning.
The site was earning around 3k-5k in income per month after PayPal fees, chargebacks, and legally required tax cuts, however I'm unsure if any owner prior to Bebosny ever paid those taxes.
1k worth of this was from google adsense (generated by non-premium users), and the rest was from on-site purchases.
Source:
Several PayPal monthly summaries, and direct access to bebosny's google adsense control panel.
A screenshot I took of the google adsense monthly digest:
A screenshot I took of the PayPal statements for september: (a month generating a more averaged income)
The site was earning around 3k-5k in income per month after PayPal fees, chargebacks, and legally required tax cuts, however I'm unsure if any owner prior to Bebosny ever paid those taxes.
1k worth of this was from google adsense (generated by non-premium users), and the rest was from on-site purchases.
Source:
Several PayPal monthly summaries, and direct access to bebosny's google adsense control panel.
A screenshot I took of the google adsense monthly digest:
A screenshot I took of the PayPal statements for september: (a month generating a more averaged income)
Last edited:
I'm as disappointed about the situation as you are, however, opinions are best expressed with facts and reasoning. I do hope that's what they're based off of, after all. Certainly sharing that would also serve to express your feelings on the situation.
Throwing around disrespectful insults only degrades the value of whatever you're saying, not to mention leaves it liable to be removed, as we do not allow that sort of negative targeting on our site, even to members who you might feel deserve it.
The very first post in this thread asked one thing, that we remain civil.
Please do so. I'd like for this discussion to be that, a discussion, not a reenactment of the cold war.
Thanks for understanding.
That goes for everyone, please.
It is virtually impossible for a POV to be completely true.
Mick is greedy, selfish and a bad human being overall.* <- Way better.
Would we rather want one who cares only about the money?* <- Again way better.
I do agree with your statement though.
Joined yesterday, knows backstory to all this and Verringer. Legit 100% not alt.
Honestly I think people really could care less about how much money is made. Instead, people are inflamed due to the fact that these funds that are supposed to go towards the site's development are being split in half and going towards Mick. Yes he owns the site, but we make purchases for the site, not Mick. I'm not intending to be paying for Mick's University fund here.Everyone is throwing their own numbers around for what the site was earning.
The site was earning around 3k-5k in income per month after PayPal fees, chargebacks, and legally required tax cuts, however I'm unsure if any owner prior to Bebosny ever paid those taxes.
1k worth of this was from google adsense (generated by non-premium users), and the rest was from on-site purchases.
Source:
Several PayPal monthly summaries, and direct access to bebosny's google adsense control panel.
A screenshot I took of the google adsense monthly digest:
A screenshot I took of the PayPal statements for september: (a month generating a more averaged income)
Again new statement: http://sta.sh/013rtfu2w93l by le one and only Coco.
She probably put quite a lot of time into the wording and such. That is probably why it took so long.
Is what she wanted to say with the release. Or that is what Justis posted in the Discord.
Last edited:
A bit late to the party but since everyone has decided to offer two cents, I figured I'd just reiterate some of the posts here and throw in 2 more cents.
BeBosny and I do have communication outside of this forum. We're pretty cool, most of the time. He makes a fair earning from actual, real life activities. I don't think Minecraft forum money is even worth it for his time, but he has personally said if he had the chance he wouldn't ever really want to sell this site (assuming in this case he had full ownership of it). I'm guessing he enjoys being here, for whatever reason he has (I don't quite see it). He worked hard and well on this site, spent time getting add-ons made, thinking of ways to improve the forum and interacting with the members in a friendly way.
He was, by far, the most skilled, educated, mature, responsible and appropriate owner this site has had and arguably could have.
So far, that would just mean there's regret and sorrow from the community; a stupid decision by the owner, Mick, to be changing management. I read that he was offered $49,000 by BeBosny to buy this site out. That would be a great offer, a large return on investment and a good offer with revenues, profits, and potential cash flow in consideration. But it's not only a bad business decision, it's completely illegal.
Assuming their contract was written in a more formal way, and we're only seeing a summarised (or "executive") version of the contract, this is actually illegal. It violates terms in the contract to "kick" out BeBosny. Without being a lawyer or seeing an actual contract, it's clear that while there are loopholes in that version, it's pretty evident that Mick acted in bad faith to remove BeBosny as the operator of this forum. It was well before the minimum 3 year length.
Not only that, but this deal was a sour deal for BeBosny. The profit splits to run the forum completely were awful. Going on that, all development for the site also went out of BeBosny's pocket... for a site he doesn't even own! What the hell... Development of Mick's site is Mick's problem and Mick's expense, but BeBosny decided to put it out of his pocket, to my best knowledge (according to the terms of that contract), and better the forum. This evidently shows Mick's lack of care or responsibility for this forum.
So it was not only stupid, illegal, exploitative, but it was also unethical. Baiting him around for over a month with some bullshit story is just plain wrong. Be straight with him. He's a businessman, not a kid (ironic).
Additionally, as I discussed earlier this evening in the shoutbox, MCM is not ran legally. There are many ways in which this site is ran illegally, both in terms of corporate laws and taxation (and that's just the taxation that we know about). Anyone could report this site and Mick, or Mick's father, depending on their legal arrangements (likely his father) would probably be in fines of 5 figures just for the corporate misconduct that I have proof about, if there is tax evasion involved this would rise to high 5 or even 6 figures.
The only form of professionalism shown right now is not conducting censorship. The next mature thing to do would be to address every single concern in this thread, not just a generic announcement. Mick is a kid, like last time, his interest will fade away in a week tops. He does not have the experience or the ability to run this site. That's not meant to be offensive, it's just a fact. It's a skill and a mentality; you have it or you don't.
Apologies for any grammatical errors. It's a bit late here and I'm sick of typing things, had to type a lot of stuff up recently. It should still be readable.
BeBosny and I do have communication outside of this forum. We're pretty cool, most of the time. He makes a fair earning from actual, real life activities. I don't think Minecraft forum money is even worth it for his time, but he has personally said if he had the chance he wouldn't ever really want to sell this site (assuming in this case he had full ownership of it). I'm guessing he enjoys being here, for whatever reason he has (I don't quite see it). He worked hard and well on this site, spent time getting add-ons made, thinking of ways to improve the forum and interacting with the members in a friendly way.
He was, by far, the most skilled, educated, mature, responsible and appropriate owner this site has had and arguably could have.
So far, that would just mean there's regret and sorrow from the community; a stupid decision by the owner, Mick, to be changing management. I read that he was offered $49,000 by BeBosny to buy this site out. That would be a great offer, a large return on investment and a good offer with revenues, profits, and potential cash flow in consideration. But it's not only a bad business decision, it's completely illegal.
Assuming their contract was written in a more formal way, and we're only seeing a summarised (or "executive") version of the contract, this is actually illegal. It violates terms in the contract to "kick" out BeBosny. Without being a lawyer or seeing an actual contract, it's clear that while there are loopholes in that version, it's pretty evident that Mick acted in bad faith to remove BeBosny as the operator of this forum. It was well before the minimum 3 year length.
Not only that, but this deal was a sour deal for BeBosny. The profit splits to run the forum completely were awful. Going on that, all development for the site also went out of BeBosny's pocket... for a site he doesn't even own! What the hell... Development of Mick's site is Mick's problem and Mick's expense, but BeBosny decided to put it out of his pocket, to my best knowledge (according to the terms of that contract), and better the forum. This evidently shows Mick's lack of care or responsibility for this forum.
So it was not only stupid, illegal, exploitative, but it was also unethical. Baiting him around for over a month with some bullshit story is just plain wrong. Be straight with him. He's a businessman, not a kid (ironic).
Additionally, as I discussed earlier this evening in the shoutbox, MCM is not ran legally. There are many ways in which this site is ran illegally, both in terms of corporate laws and taxation (and that's just the taxation that we know about). Anyone could report this site and Mick, or Mick's father, depending on their legal arrangements (likely his father) would probably be in fines of 5 figures just for the corporate misconduct that I have proof about, if there is tax evasion involved this would rise to high 5 or even 6 figures.
The only form of professionalism shown right now is not conducting censorship. The next mature thing to do would be to address every single concern in this thread, not just a generic announcement. Mick is a kid, like last time, his interest will fade away in a week tops. He does not have the experience or the ability to run this site. That's not meant to be offensive, it's just a fact. It's a skill and a mentality; you have it or you don't.
Apologies for any grammatical errors. It's a bit late here and I'm sick of typing things, had to type a lot of stuff up recently. It should still be readable.
Last edited:
I run a few businesses. I'm not a lawyer but I have a legal team (one I would say is very qualified) I work with quite often to ensure everything is going well within my businesses. A lot of these questions have popped up in my situations so some statements I make will just be from personal experiences and knowledge from my lawyers. Sometimes I'll just make statements based on common sense.
An example of applying common sense: it's illegal (at least by UK law, Australian corporate law often overlaps and this is a general thing, so I am guessing it applies here also) to not show who is the owner of the site. The terms show BeBosny's company as the operators, which doesn't matter, the ownership is not declared. Heck, we don't know if the legal owner is Mick or his dad. That's not allowed by UK law, and I'm guessing it's a similar thing in Australia (although I cannot quote). Taxation is similar in concept everywhere: you pay your taxes. Unfortunately, we don't know if MCM is correctly paying its dues within Australia (I very highly doubt it, I guess there's a way to find out - report Mick/his father to the ATO), but we do know that they are not complying with VAT MOSS anymore which is a legal requirement for all digital businesses. The EU has good ties with Australia and, if it was worth it to them, they could easily pursue this.
- Status
