The most recent post in the Announcements forum made by Mick announces that Discord Nitro sales and Discord Nitro Boost sales will now be banned due to "excessive scamming". While there is merit to the ban in favour of reducing the number of users that will get scammed, here is a quick review based on my opinions of the ban:
1. The post says that the sections were removed due to "excessive scamming". A quick review of the first 5 pages of the Scam Reports Archive, and the Scam Reports section (which should not be counted, because unless the user has actually scammed out; it can't be counted as a scam) - more Scam Reports were made by users on reputable users for development services and configuration services than any product, let alone Discord Boosts & Nitro codes. A closer look into the Scam Reports of those users reveals that the majority (excluding one high-profile ban) were new users, who are predisposed to scam out anyway - a higher majority of the Banned Users in the Scam Reports Archive is made up of newer users - and due to the low-cost, easy-transaction nature of products in the Gift Codes & Licenses section, newer users (who are often ban evaders) find it easy to scam out. This is not only the case for Discord Boosts/Nitros, and I will address this later.
2. The argument for Discord Boosts being blackhat/greyhat has little merit now in the wake of the Epic Games offer. There is a perfectly legal way to obtain Nitro codes and Boosts without needing to card, perform identity theft, or any other illegal activity now, and the argument would have had more merit a month earlier or 4 months later (when the offer and codes expire fully). A ban is only hurting the community from purchasing perfectly legitimate services. If staff really does believe there is a need for a review of the methods used to purchase these boosts, then they can do so (I believe they have done this in the past?).
3. The greater argument to be made is the high-risk for buyers in the Gifts & Licenses section along with the Other Products session - which is a perfectly reasonable and valid argument. However, banning boosts sets a dangerous precedent as soon the section will be completely phased out of use because of "excessive scamming". Newer users are far more likely to scam in this section than a more established user is - high-value scams by established users happen in Services or the Currency Conversion sections but that isn't the point here.
The recent offers are an easy way for people to make profit if they know what they're doing and that profit finds its way back into the MCM community and also as revenue for MC-M - several legitimate sellers (myself included) can make legitimate profits from this. Banning sections like this arbitrarily only hurts the community rather than protecting it from scams since they will occur offsite in any case.
Another thing to note is that the decision was (reportedly) unilateral by Mick and staff did not get much of a say (according to a discussion I had with Geek in shoutbox). While this in itself may not be a bad thing, it does bring up the issue that the community is not well-represented by the staff. We were also not informed of this decision the way we were for the Investments and Loans forum.
SOLUTIONS:
Every good suggestion has a solution: here are mine.
1. Unban Discord Nitro and Boost Selling.
2. Increase the requirements to post in the Gift Codes & Licenses and the Other Products forum due to their high-risk nature by newer users. Reputation requirements and message requirements are a good start. Scams will reduce dramatically.
3. Allow staff to perform reviews on members who they suspect of illegitimate activity. A private conversation with Ally revealed a good point that most of the Nitro community treats their business models very carefully (though this is due to the nature that people steal ideas quickly and there is no protection against that here) and I assume Nitro sellers and Boost sellers would be more than happy to reveal their (legitimate) methods to staff under guarantee they won't be resold.
TLDR:
1. banned for excessive scamming but increase of requirements will make sure new users can't scam out easily and leave way for trusted sellers (who are less predisposed to scam)
2. no longer blackhat and greyhat due to recent epic games offers and staff can verify those who seem suspicious
3. community sentiment was not taken into hand
I will defend my opinions.
1. The post says that the sections were removed due to "excessive scamming". A quick review of the first 5 pages of the Scam Reports Archive, and the Scam Reports section (which should not be counted, because unless the user has actually scammed out; it can't be counted as a scam) - more Scam Reports were made by users on reputable users for development services and configuration services than any product, let alone Discord Boosts & Nitro codes. A closer look into the Scam Reports of those users reveals that the majority (excluding one high-profile ban) were new users, who are predisposed to scam out anyway - a higher majority of the Banned Users in the Scam Reports Archive is made up of newer users - and due to the low-cost, easy-transaction nature of products in the Gift Codes & Licenses section, newer users (who are often ban evaders) find it easy to scam out. This is not only the case for Discord Boosts/Nitros, and I will address this later.
2. The argument for Discord Boosts being blackhat/greyhat has little merit now in the wake of the Epic Games offer. There is a perfectly legal way to obtain Nitro codes and Boosts without needing to card, perform identity theft, or any other illegal activity now, and the argument would have had more merit a month earlier or 4 months later (when the offer and codes expire fully). A ban is only hurting the community from purchasing perfectly legitimate services. If staff really does believe there is a need for a review of the methods used to purchase these boosts, then they can do so (I believe they have done this in the past?).
3. The greater argument to be made is the high-risk for buyers in the Gifts & Licenses section along with the Other Products session - which is a perfectly reasonable and valid argument. However, banning boosts sets a dangerous precedent as soon the section will be completely phased out of use because of "excessive scamming". Newer users are far more likely to scam in this section than a more established user is - high-value scams by established users happen in Services or the Currency Conversion sections but that isn't the point here.
The recent offers are an easy way for people to make profit if they know what they're doing and that profit finds its way back into the MCM community and also as revenue for MC-M - several legitimate sellers (myself included) can make legitimate profits from this. Banning sections like this arbitrarily only hurts the community rather than protecting it from scams since they will occur offsite in any case.
Another thing to note is that the decision was (reportedly) unilateral by Mick and staff did not get much of a say (according to a discussion I had with Geek in shoutbox). While this in itself may not be a bad thing, it does bring up the issue that the community is not well-represented by the staff. We were also not informed of this decision the way we were for the Investments and Loans forum.
SOLUTIONS:
Every good suggestion has a solution: here are mine.
1. Unban Discord Nitro and Boost Selling.
2. Increase the requirements to post in the Gift Codes & Licenses and the Other Products forum due to their high-risk nature by newer users. Reputation requirements and message requirements are a good start. Scams will reduce dramatically.
3. Allow staff to perform reviews on members who they suspect of illegitimate activity. A private conversation with Ally revealed a good point that most of the Nitro community treats their business models very carefully (though this is due to the nature that people steal ideas quickly and there is no protection against that here) and I assume Nitro sellers and Boost sellers would be more than happy to reveal their (legitimate) methods to staff under guarantee they won't be resold.
TLDR:
1. banned for excessive scamming but increase of requirements will make sure new users can't scam out easily and leave way for trusted sellers (who are less predisposed to scam)
2. no longer blackhat and greyhat due to recent epic games offers and staff can verify those who seem suspicious
3. community sentiment was not taken into hand
I will defend my opinions.
- Type
- Suggestion
- Status
- Denied
Banned forever. Reason: Scamming (https://builtbybit.com/threads/cam-v-bugless-transaction-dispute.671198/)
