100+ AGREES - Disallow "Time Waste" Neg Reps

[Satan]

Negative Reputations revolving around the statement of "User wasted my time DNDW" etc. should be disallowed if they meet these 2 conditions:

1. There is no evidence (screenshots, threads, conversation text, etc.) of any money movement/transaction/a deal taking place (a failed deal basically)
2. There is no evidence to suggest the "time waster" is a scammer or displays behavior akin to what a scammer would do (attempted scamming)

I currently have two negative reputations given by 2 bot developers for "wasting their time" or more specifically in Medi 's case, I did not commission him. I stated that I do not wish to commission him and here is the spoiler for the chat logs if you'd like to read through it all.

Spoiler: Chatlog with Medi regarding declining to commission/hire him

Medi02/14/2018


Oh hello?



We have affiliated before it seems



So your looking for one bot to do both features in the 2 posts you made or 2 seperate bots?


zDrakon 02/14/2018


2 seperate



i already hve 1 working


Medi02/14/2018


So you only need 1 bot?



Is there someone already working on this? What exactly do you need done in which is left?


zDrakon 02/14/2018


working on the other bot



the timer bot



not worke don


Medi02/14/2018


Okay so can you specify on what you need..?(edited)


zDrakon 02/14/2018


thread explains


Medi02/14/2018


So what is all done?



And what all do you still need done, The communication is very lacking and the thread is not very detailed.


zDrakon 02/14/2018


The other bot is working on


Medi02/14/2018


The other bot is working on?



That sentence does not make sense.(edited)


zDrakon 02/14/2018


The other bot is being worked on


zDrakon 02/14/2018


I get the feeling you don't take initiative. Thank you for your time, I will not be commissioning you.

February 26, 2018

Medi02/26/2018


aaaaaand later hater.

I've reported his reputation before and apparently it was not removed and he was not given any consequence. He's allowed to leave a valid negative reputation just because I did not feel like hiring him... there were other bot developers who showed immediate interest to work on what I requested.

Let's move onto the 2nd negative reputation that I feel should be invalidated. alice left a negative reputation with me after I decided that I would go with another bot developer.

I hired her initially to make a automatic toggle ping bot and that went well. Then I called her up in a voice call to explain what I wanted developed next but I did not guarantee hiring her as I clearly stated in the voice call that I would use her as a backup/runner up if my main bot dev does not work on the bot idea I had.

After 24 hours of waiting, my main bot dev got back to me saying he could take the job and alice then went on with an attitude of "you wasted my time" and left me a negative reputation with exactly that. She also went on to say "Open a scam report, you won't win" after I believed that there were bugs with the ping bot she made.

The gist/summary of this all
Negative reputation should only be allowed if a deal took place & both parties do not display scammer/suspicious behavior. If a potential customer does not wish to hire you, you have no right to say "you wasted my time" and leave that as a valid negative reputation.

If freelancers reserve all rights to not take a commission for any reason, customers deserve the same rights to deny hiring any freelancers for whatever reason so long as it was not an attempted scam.

 

[Medi]

Negative Reputations revolving around the statement of "User wasted my time DNDW" etc. should be disallowed if they meet these 2 conditions:

1. There is no evidence (screenshots, threads, conversation text, etc.) of any money movement/transaction/a deal taking place (a failed deal basically)
2. There is no evidence to suggest the "time waster" is a scammer or displays behavior akin to what a scammer would do (attempted scamming)

I currently have two negative reputations given by 2 bot developers for "wasting their time" or more specifically in Medi 's case, I did not commission him. I stated that I do not wish to commission him and here is the spoiler for the chat logs if you'd like to read through it all.

Spoiler: Chatlog with Medi regarding declining to commission/hire him

Medi02/14/2018


Oh hello?



We have affiliated before it seems



So your looking for one bot to do both features in the 2 posts you made or 2 seperate bots?


zDrakon 02/14/2018


2 seperate



i already hve 1 working


Medi02/14/2018


So you only need 1 bot?



Is there someone already working on this? What exactly do you need done in which is left?


zDrakon 02/14/2018


working on the other bot



the timer bot



not worke don


Medi02/14/2018


Okay so can you specify on what you need..?(edited)


zDrakon 02/14/2018


thread explains


Medi02/14/2018


So what is all done?



And what all do you still need done, The communication is very lacking and the thread is not very detailed.


zDrakon 02/14/2018


The other bot is working on


Medi02/14/2018


The other bot is working on?



That sentence does not make sense.(edited)


zDrakon 02/14/2018


The other bot is being worked on


zDrakon 02/14/2018


I get the feeling you don't take initiative. Thank you for your time, I will not be commissioning you.

February 26, 2018

Medi02/26/2018


aaaaaand later hater.

I've reported his reputation before and apparently it was not removed and he was not given any consequence. He's allowed to leave a valid negative reputation just because I did not feel like hiring him... there were other bot developers who showed immediate interest to work on what I requested.

Let's move onto the 2nd negative reputation that I feel should be invalidated. alice left a negative reputation with me after I decided that I would go with another bot developer.

I hired her initially to make a automatic toggle ping bot and that went well. Then I called her up in a voice call to explain what I wanted developed next but I did not guarantee hiring her as I clearly stated in the voice call that I would use her as a backup/runner up if my main bot dev does not work on the bot idea I had.

After 24 hours of waiting, my main bot dev got back to me saying he could take the job and alice then went on with an attitude of "you wasted my time" and left me a negative reputation with exactly that. She also went on to say "Open a scam report, you won't win" after I believed that there were bugs with the ping bot she made.

The gist/summary of this all
Negative reputation should only be allowed if a deal took place & both parties do not display scammer/suspicious behavior. If a potential customer does not wish to hire you, you have no right to say "you wasted my time" and leave that as a valid negative reputation.

If freelancers reserve all rights to not take a commission for any reason, customers deserve the same rights to deny hiring any freelancers for whatever reason so long as it was not an attempted scam.

Actually hilarious, as the user has left out literally the entire discussion of this project. This thread is "Time Waste".[DOUBLEPOST=1541785187][/DOUBLEPOST]Also this user is clearly just upset he has negative reputation, Maybe get outside more.

 

[Satan]

Actually hilarious, as the user has left out literally the entire discussion of this project.

Um... you might want to open your eyes and read the spoiler that says
"Chatlog with Medi regarding declining to commission/hire him"

https://gyazo.com/2169dfa22fb63fc89138ee0f05e6f78c

 

[alice]

rip, looks like multiple developers have been unhappy with you. Maybe you're the problem.

I hired her initially to make a automatic toggle ping bot and that went well. Then I called her up in a voice call to explain what I wanted developed next but I did not guarantee hiring her as I clearly stated in the voice call that I would use her as a backup/runner up if my main bot dev does not work on the bot idea I had.

After 24 hours of waiting, my main bot dev got back to me saying he could take the job and @ally then went on with an attitude of "you wasted my time" and left me a negative reputation with exactly that. She also went on to say "Open a scam report, you won't win" after I believed that there were bugs with the ping bot she made.

Yes, although you initially said that you would ask your main bot dev before me, you still talked to me on VC for 20 minutes about the project you wanted, and I gave you advice and happily talked about the project with you.

If you had any decent etiquette and morals as a person, you would've just been like "hey ally, you can take on the project instead" since I was there, talking to you about it, ready to start it. Instead, you delayed it an entire day to run to a cheaper, rude/arrogant dev who copy pastes code, because the only thing you care about is making money off of other devs' work and as the reputation above has shown, you are inconsiderate and unempathetic towards devs, especially when you are extremely picky for certain features with or want a command for every little thing to be customizable with your small budget.

I do consider you a time waster. And for the record, you're the one who modified your rep and gave me neutral rep first talking about a non-existent bug in the bot I sent you probably contributed by temporary discord server lag or something, so I gave you -rep back. I was willing to leave it alone at +rep and move on. You asked for all of this.

 

[Satan]

dev who copy pastes code

I won't deny he was pretty rude/arrogant. But you have no proof he copy pastes code.

gave me neutral rep first talking about a non-existent bug in the bot I sent you probably contributed by temporary discord server lag

It was neutral. It was not a reason to give a negative reputation back. Neutral =/= Negative. I would've been fine leaving it at neutral. Also CmdData posted his rep recently like literally 10 minutes ago. I left a reputation on him a while back, interesting how he voices privately on my reputation...

you are inconsiderate and unempathetic towards devs, especially when you are extremely picky for certain features with or want a command for every little thing to be customizable with your small budget.

I am picky for certain features. Inconsiderate... yet I threw in a $5 tip just because you were working hard on the other bot. My budget at the time was small but I managed to get enough money to pay for my other projects including the form bot we talked about. I no longer have a "small budget" in the means of 2 digits to 3. If my budget is too small, by all means find a different customer and cater to others.

Anyhow alice whatever you just mentioned is irrelevant to the point of the thread. I'm arguing that wasting time is no way shape or form displaying behavior of being a scammer nor was any deal/money moved after I first commissioned you.

 

[OwO]

rip, looks like multiple developers have been unhappy with you. Maybe you're the problem.



Yes, although you initially said that you would ask your main bot dev before me, you still talked to me on VC for 20 minutes about the project you wanted, and I gave you advice and happily talked about the project with you.

If you had any decent etiquette and morals as a person, you would've just been like "hey ally, you can take on the project instead" since I was there, talking to you about it, ready to start it. Instead, you delayed it an entire day to run to a cheaper, rude/arrogant dev who copy pastes code, because the only thing you care about is making money off of other devs' work and as the reputation above has shown, you are inconsiderate and unempathetic towards devs, especially when you are extremely picky for certain features with or want a command for every little thing to be customizable with your small budget.

I do consider you a time waster. And for the record, you're the one who modified your rep and gave me neutral rep first talking about a non-existent bug in the bot I sent you probably contributed by temporary discord server lag or something, so I gave you -rep back. I was willing to leave it alone at +rep and move on. You asked for all of this.

Well, knowing you were gonna be his backup, if there was a reasonable chance the 1st dev wouldn't or couldn't do it, he didn't do anything wrong. Also, having a small budget isn't a reason to neg rep somebody, if you think you wouldn't be making enough money from it, just decline the deal, and there is nothing wrong about making money off of something you legitimately own.

 

[alice]

I won't deny he was pretty rude/arrogant. But you have no proof he copy pastes code.


It was neutral. It was not a reason to give a negative reputation back. Neutral =/= Negative. I would've been fine leaving it at neutral. Also CmdData posted his rep recently like literally 10 minutes ago. I left a reputation on him a while back, interesting how he voices privately on my reputation...


I am picky for certain features. Inconsiderate... yet I threw in a $5 tip just because you were working hard on the other bot. My budget at the time was small but I managed to get enough money to pay for my other projects including the form bot we talked about. I no longer have a "small budget" in the means of 2 digits to 3. If my budget is too small, by all means find a different customer and cater to others.

Anyhow alice whatever you just mentioned is irrelevant to the point of the thread. I'm arguing that wasting time is no way shape or form displaying behavior of being a scammer nor was any deal/money moved after I first commissioned you.

You literally said yourself that he found source code on GitHub that he's going to "refactor". Also, I never called you a scammer or implied that you may be a scammer.

But that doesn't mean that I don't think you're dodgy and will potentially decomission devs after they do half of the project for you because they can't finish it on the exact ETA due to an unexpected issue.

Well, knowing you were gonna be his backup, if there was a reasonable chance the 1st dev wouldn't or couldn't do it, he didn't do anything wrong. Also, having a small budget isn't a reason to neg rep somebody, if you think you wouldn't be making enough money from it, just decline the deal, and there is nothing wrong about making money off of something you legitimately own.

I didn't -rep him for his small budget. I -repped him because I don't like him and I personally consider him a time waster.

 

[MarkFreak]

You literally said yourself that he found source code on GitHub that he's going to "refactor". Also, I never called you a scammer or implied that you may be a scammer.

But that doesn't mean that I don't think you're dodgy and will potentially decomission devs after they do half of the project for you because they can't finish it on the exact ETA due to an unexpected issue.


I didn't -rep him for his small budget. I -repped him because I don't like him and I personally consider him a time waster.

I never used open-sourced code and refactored it for Drakon's use. Him saying vs me doing is a different thing.

 

[alice]

I still don't see how my rep is invalid.

 

[Ambrosia]

rip, looks like multiple developers have been unhappy with you. Maybe you're the problem.



Yes, although you initially said that you would ask your main bot dev before me, you still talked to me on VC for 20 minutes about the project you wanted, and I gave you advice and happily talked about the project with you.

If you had any decent etiquette and morals as a person, you would've just been like "hey ally, you can take on the project instead" since I was there, talking to you about it, ready to start it. Instead, you delayed it an entire day to run to a cheaper, rude/arrogant dev who copy pastes code, because the only thing you care about is making money off of other devs' work and as the reputation above has shown, you are inconsiderate and unempathetic towards devs, especially when you are extremely picky for certain features with or want a command for every little thing to be customizable with your small budget.

I do consider you a time waster. And for the record, you're the one who modified your rep and gave me neutral rep first talking about a non-existent bug in the bot I sent you probably contributed by temporary discord server lag or something, so I gave you -rep back. I was willing to leave it alone at +rep and move on. You asked for all of this.

If he couldnt finish in time he has all rights to decommission him and ask for a refund.

 

[Satan]

I still don't see how my rep is invalid.

Its invalid because I didn't display any behavior akin to a scammer nor was any money moved/a deal happened. The reputation system should be used toward deals that took place with money moved. Otherwise, it really should be invalid rep unless scammer behavior.

I -repped him because I don't like him and I personally consider him a time waster.

This is why your rep is invalid. Its personal, its an opinion of you onto me from something that has to do with a deal not happening.

 

[alice]

Its invalid because I didn't display any behavior akin to a scammer nor was any money moved/a deal happened. The reputation system should be used toward deals that took place with money moved. Otherwise, it really should be invalid rep unless scammer behavior.


This is why your rep is invalid. Its personal, its an opinion of you onto me from something that has to do with a deal not happening.

But no one called you a scammer (that would be against the rules without a link to an open scam report).

The reputation system can be used though to -rep someone if you don't like them for a certain reason. Isn't that the entire point of reputation? I bet you wouldn't complain if someone gave you +rep saying that you're speedy/not a time waster, lol.

 

[CmdData]

I won't deny he was pretty rude/arrogant. But you have no proof he copy pastes code.


It was neutral. It was not a reason to give a negative reputation back. Neutral =/= Negative. I would've been fine leaving it at neutral. Also CmdData posted his rep recently like literally 10 minutes ago. I left a reputation on him a while back, interesting how he voices privately on my reputation...


I am picky for certain features. Inconsiderate... yet I threw in a $5 tip just because you were working hard on the other bot. My budget at the time was small but I managed to get enough money to pay for my other projects including the form bot we talked about. I no longer have a "small budget" in the means of 2 digits to 3. If my budget is too small, by all means find a different customer and cater to others.

Anyhow alice whatever you just mentioned is irrelevant to the point of the thread. I'm arguing that wasting time is no way shape or form displaying behavior of being a scammer nor was any deal/money moved after I first commissioned you.

Ok listen here. I posted my rep 10 minutes ago because you somehow got mods to remove mine I made months ago. I won't bash you here, but removing negative reps that make you seem unfavourable to people looking for a job with you is scumbag level 100. Don't do that.

 

[Satan]

But no one called you a scammer (that would be against the rules without a link to an open scam report).

The reputation system can be used though to -rep someone if you don't like them for a certain reason. Isn't that the entire point of reputation? I bet you wouldn't complain if someone gave you +rep saying that you're speedy/not a time waster, lol.

If Im given a reputation that said I wasn't a time waster and there was money sent... of course I wouldn't report or complain about it? Its a valid deal and it was fast... Where is your logic coming from? I'm not saying you called me a scammer, I'm saying that as a condition to the suggestion I put on this thread.[DOUBLEPOST=1541794021][/DOUBLEPOST]

Ok listen here. I posted my rep 10 minutes ago because you somehow got mods to remove mine I made months ago. I won't bash you here, but removing negative reps that make you seem unfavourable to people looking for a job with you is scumbag level 100. Don't do that.

I got mods to remove it months ago because it was invalid... and now there are new mods who aren't reviewing reputations with the same standards... hence my suggestion

 

[CmdData]

If Im given a reputation that said I wasn't a time waster and there was money sent... of course I wouldn't report or complain about it? Its a valid deal and it was fast... Where is your logic coming from? I'm not saying you called me a scammer, I'm saying that as a condition to the suggestion I put on this thread.[DOUBLEPOST=1541794021][/DOUBLEPOST]
I got mods to remove it months ago because it was invalid... and now there are new mods who aren't reviewing reputations with the same standards... hence my suggestion

Explain to me why it was invalid. The deal wasn't made, I didn't open a scam report because it was just some lost time, but I posted a neg rep because I felt like other people should be made aware of past situations with buyers/sellers before going forward with a deal. That's the whole fucking point of the rep system

 

[Satan]

That's the whole fucking point of the rep system

The point of the reputation system should only be for deals that took place unless

one or both conditions I mentioned in the OP happened.

By your logic, the reputation system could be used as a means to say "This user is just a bad guy to work with because I get the vibe he is". No evidence, no money was moved/a deal took place, nadah. How is this a valid rep system usage?

 

[CmdData]

At this point i'm going to stop arguing because clearly you haven't learned anything. You're still the introverted narcissistic time-waster as when I first met you. Good luck with your pointless suggestion that defeats the purpose of a rep system

Edit: And now you're using the react system in the suggestion category on the wrong posts. Gratz

 

[Satan]

Edit: And now you're using the react system in the suggestion category on the wrong posts. Gratz

Actually, I reacted to it because I disagree with

pointless suggestion that defeats the purpose of a rep system

 

[Satan]

I think that if someone let's say backs out of a deal within 30 minutes or an hour or 2 it's fine and they shouldn't be allowed to give you a negative reputation because that could mess up your whole business persona.

But let's say you have been dealing with someone for the past week and he's been holding you off giving you multiple excuses and then goes to say hey sorry I can't do it anymore. Unless there is some sort of compensation, I think a negative reputation would be perfectly fine in that situation.

While I do see this time sort of thing as a valid gray area to put neg rep and leave it alone, this would require users to timestamp their conversations with images and slap it onto a negative reputation to stay there on the user who delayed for a week. This would be too high of a requirement to expect of users I think, and the less grey area there is, the easier it is for staff on here to review reputations with the same standard, hence why I don't put in a time "limit" to the original post of my suggestion.